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DDOcast 289 – Player’s Choice Design for TR

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Its the True Reincarnation Episode! Sig, Anne, and Geoff (http://www.ddocast.com) touch a bit on some DDO news and community happenings, but the meat of this podcast is about the latest announcement from Sr. Producer Erik Boyer (aka Producer Glin) on the proposed system for Epic TR, Iconic TR, and Heroic TR. We go over Glin’s announcement and follow up posts in detail, and responses from other Turbine Devs. We also read on player reactions for the new TR system.

Player’s Choice Design
A True Reincarnation System Proposal for DDO

By Sigfried Trent

Introduction
The new Epic TR proposal from Turbine had a lot good ideas, but includes a fatal flaw. The loss of Epic Destiny XP simply makes the system anything but attractive for many DDO players. Many of us imagined something better, myself included. Mulling it over in my mind, weighing the needs of developers and players alike, I feel like I’ve come up with an iron clad update to what Turbine Proposed. I’m calling it the Player’s Choice Design (PCD).

I’d like to propose that the players of DDO rally together to support this plan and lobby for Turbine to adopt it. I don’t expect it will be everyone’s favorite plan, but if we want to have an impact, speaking in one voice will be far more persuasive.

If you like what you see, then you can join the cause by lobbying the Developers to adopt the PCD and let turbine prove to us it is truly powered by its fans!

Quick Summary
My proposal is very similar to Turbines initial offering but does not involve losing the majority of epic destiny XP you have earned. Instead, each life you choose a single destiny to work on, and reset only that destinies XP. There is a bit more to it, but that is the core of the idea.

Design Objectives

  • Encourage players to enjoy the full range of DDO content
  • Allow a path for continuous improvement and experimentation for characters
  • Not loose any long term progress when true reincarnating

Proposals for Each of the TR Types

There are now three types of reincarnation.

Lesser Reincarnation

  • Available at any level
  • You may reconfigure Ability Scores, Skills, Feats, and Enhancements.
  • Grants you a 32pt build if you were not already 32pts
  • Optional ability to reconfigure limited class levels
  • All tomes are preserved

Heroic Reincarnation

  • Available at level 20 or above
  • Grants future lives a Stacking Past life feat based on class up to three times per class on reincarnation
  • Grants future lives access to selectable feats
  • Next live gets +2 build points, up to 36 maximum
  • Resets Character Level XP to 0 and lets you roll a new character
    • All tomes are preserved along with character name
    • Reincarnating into an Iconic Hero class sets XP to level 15
  • If you have one past life for each character class you are also granted the completionist feat giving you a stacking +2 bonus to all ability scores. (this does not take up a feat slot as it does currently)

Epic Reincarnation

  • Available at current max level (28)
  • Requires 1 selected XP capped “Chosen Epic Destiny” (see below for details)
  • Grants an Epic Destiny feat based on “Chosen Epic Destiny” upon reaching cap
  • Grants benefits of Heroic Reincarnation on reincarnation
  • Max build points is 38
  • Resets Character Level XP to 0 and lets you roll a new character
    • All tomes are preserved along with character name
    • If a character has every Heroic Past live benefit available (triple completionist), they can start at level 20 when they do an Epic Reincarnation.
    • Reincarnating into an Iconic Hero class sets XP to level 15
    • All Fate points are preserved, as are all destiny unlocks
    • Resents XP for next life’s chosen Epic Destiny to 0 upon Reincarnation

How The Chosen Destinies work

  • Epic Reincarnation is a little different in that it awards your Epic Destiny Past Life Feat upon capping your character rather than just after reincarnation.
  • There will be an NPC who you can speak to be awarded your past life feat. On your first epic life you may select any capped Epic Destiny as your Chosen Epic Destiny.
  • Upon Reincarnation you must select an Epic Destiny you currently have unlocked. You will lose all XP in this destiny upon when you are reborn but it remains unlocked. You must max out this destiny in your next life in order to receive your next past life feat. You do not lose any fate points for the lost XP and can in fact earn more when you gain XP in this destiny on your next life. Upon capping your epic level XP and the chosen Destiny you will receive the Epic Past Life Feat for the Chosen Epic Destiny.

Further System modifications (optional)

  • There should be a single experience point track for all True Reincarnated characters rather than the two tier model.
  • Epic class levels should have a more flattened leveling structure and not increase on subsequent lives.
  • Epic Destinies should maintain a progressive structure and add 4 maximum ED points to all destinies. Or possibly increading the XP needed for the Chosen destiny to make progression closer to epic level XP.

An example of the PCD in action!
Gungathud is currently a level 28 Barbarian 18 Fighter 2 Epic 8 with 4 past lives: 2 barbarian and 2 monk. Gungathud currently has all 3 Epic destinies maxed out: Fury of the Wild, Legendary Dreadnaught, and Grandmaster of Flowers. He has 6 more unlocked with 4 levels in Shiradi Champion, 3 in Unyielding Sentinal, 2 in Primal Avatar, 1 in Shadowdancer, and 0 in Exalted Angel.

He is hanging out in Stormreach on the day that Update 20 goes live. Because Gungathud is already capped, and has at least one capped destiny he is already entitled to an Epic Destiny Past Life feat. He goes to an Epic Destiny NPC to claim it. He can choose from Fury of the Wild, Legendary Dreadnaught or Grandmaster of Flowers. He chooses Fury of the Wild and gets the feat right then and there.

After some reflection Gungathud thinks he would like to do an Epic TR so he can go up to a 38 point build, pick up a 3rd barbarian past life feat, and work towards getting another Epic Destiny past life feat. He heads over to the Epic Reincarnation NPC. He has to choose one of his unlocked destinies to work on in the next life. He likes the Legendary Dreadnaught Epic Destiny feat so he chooses that one.

Gungathud goes through the process of Reincarnating. His Class XP is set to 0, His Legendary Dreadnaught Destiny XP is set to 0 and he re-rolls a 38pt character at level 1. He is granted his Barbarian Past life feat at this time. To get the Legendary Dreadnaught Destiny Feat he needs to get back to level 28 and cap out Legendary Dreadnaught. Then he can talk to the Epic Destiny NPC to claim that feat.

My arguments for the Players Choice Design

A True Reincarnation system should to two things:

  • Incentivize re-playing the full range of DDO’s content from level 1 to endgame.
  • Provide a slow but steady means of increasing a characters maximum potential.

And there are two things it should not do:

  • Interfere with the planning and effort players have already invested in the Epic Destiny System
  • Require more effort than the process of leveling from 1 to cap in order to rebuild a character at least as strong as the one you had before reincarnating.

Problems with the current Turbine proposal

  • The loss of Epic Destiny experience and fate points represents a huge loss of time for many players, not just the raw XP, but also time spent playing in destinies not suited to their character’s abilities.
  • Upon capping their next life, many characters would be significantly weaker than were in their previous life due to the loss of Epic Destinies and fate points.
  • The proposed Epic Advantage system would effectively skip lower level content which is contrary to one of the primary goals of the reincarnation system.

Advantages of the Players Choice Design over the current proposal

  • Saving Player Investments: Players who have invested time and effort and even money into leveling epic destinies will not lose the fruits of that effort. They may lose XP in a single destiny of their choosing, but the process of leveling from 20 to cap will provide more than enough XP to re-train the destiny.
  • Creating Work Where it Makes Sense: Clearing the single destiny, which you must re-train to gain your Epic Past Life Feat, helps provide you with more something impactful to advance as you go from 20 to cap. Since you are reincarnating and likely in a different class, you can coordinate your target Heroic Class with the Epic Destiny you are working on. This should make for a more rewarding leveling experience.
  • Rewards in the Right Place and Time: The PCD rewards you for capping your character, something the game currently doesn’t do. If you are capped then you will get a taste of the new system right away and rewarded for your efforts so far. You can spend some time enjoying the full power of your new feat before starting your next life.
  • Includes All of DDO Content: It does not skip over any of DDO’s content (with the exception of Iconic Characters).
  • Better Completionist: The completionist reward is no longer something that requires a feat slot, forcing you to make a trade off to get the benefit of your significant efforts to achieve it.
  • Keeping it Simple: It isn’t very complicated and likely requires a bit less engineering than the Turbine Proposal.

How To Win a Shadowfell Conspiracy Expansion Key!

  1. Watch or Listen to DDOcast Episode 289!
  2. Read “Player’s Choice Design: True Reincarnation System Proposal”
  3. Get the URL of this post, here’s a short URL for you http://bit.ly/17idZaZ
  4. Share this link and your support for “Player’s Choice Design for TR” on either your Blog, Twitter, Facebook, G+ or website
  5. Then send us an email at ddocast@gmail.com and include a link to a public place on the internet where you have declared your support for the “Player’s Choice Design for TR”.
  6. We encourage a polite but enthusiastic tone!
  7. Sit back and wait! Or Join the conversation at the DDO Forums. The winner will be chosen randomly as usual.

Related Links

  • […] we actually play DDO so we know whats best for it! With that being said, I wish to fully endorse Sig Trents Epic TR thingy! Follow the link to learn how to show your […]

  • I wanted to point out that in the xp calculations that epic xp suffers from ‘epic inflation.’ I call it that because it’s the mentality of ‘it’s epic! it must have big numbers!’

    It’s not like trying to get from 18 to 20 running mindsunder for miniscule amounts of xp, because once you reach 20, you can get 15k+ base xp per quest (not even including bb and such).

    What matters is the curve, i.e. How many quests do you need to run to get a rank/heroic level/destiny level/epic level? Otherwise, comparisons of ED levels vs heroic levels aren’t meaningful. Time spent isn’t quite the same either, since time is based more on player ability, solo vs group play, etc.

    Anyways, just my 2 cents in paragraph form!

    Melkior Whiteblade

    June 19, 2013

  • […] ideas. Some ideas and clarifications come from Turbine. Many ideas come from players, including DDOcast’s own Player Choice Design which I heartily support (and which could earn you a free expansion pack. Listen to DDOCast 289 for […]